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Just five hours in May

What really happened to Madeleine Beth McCann?

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You may enter here any comment by appending it to the end of the text. If you like to give any confidential facts to the editor, please contact me per email — Heribert Genreith 2014/07/04 17:01

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Hi Heribert,

I think it's great what you're doing here. There is so much information out there, but it takes a lot of searching to find everything. So a very good idea of yours to start this wiki so everything can be cross-referenced. I'm still learning how to use it, but hopefully I can contribute, and others will follow.

One suggestion: Do you think it is ok to allow everyone in? It would only take one person to destroy everything that is created here. And we know that at least one of the McCann's family members is monitoring websites ;-) Are you making backups?

Thanks,

Ananke


Hi Ananke,

thanks for beeing Member #1. Thanks for contrinuting and hopefully you may do some advertising to others with serious knowledge in the case. Well I'm doing backups every one or two days. Of course it is a risk to allow everyone in. We will see. In case of spamming and flaming users may be banned. When things go more worse, we then will make closed groups of serious co-workers.

So long, best wishes, Heribert. — Heribert Genreith 2013/11/27 22:11


Thanks Heribert.

I think in time more people will join. Perhaps post another message on the forum when things are a bit more advanced.

It's not your fault, but people are very suspicious on the forum. (I had a very bad start myself).

They may think your someone else as recently there was a person (a troublemaker) on there with a German name (half British / half Austrian). They may think you're the same person. I know you're not :-).

And people don't like change ;-) and perhaps they think there's enough information out there. But that information is all over the place. Hopefully we can get it all here, referenced, and cross-referenced. It will take some time, and then we can start linking everything. It's been done many times before, but not like this as far as I know.

Tschüß,

Ananke


Thanks Ananke,

for the mail as well as for your great work done.

(Good gracious! Those Austrians, And yes I won't mention the war… “suspicion” is the most striking word for this terrible case… Well, I will do my very best, Cheerio!)

With best wishes, Heribert.


Kein Problem!

No, we won't mention the war, though one of my favourite episodes of Fawly Towers is Dont mention the War LOL


Hi Heribert,

Thanks for such a well thought and balanced view of all we know can find about Madeleine's case. Especially the most likely case of the parents involved. Your view on this most likely scenario considering all the evidence and witness statements was clarifying to me finally as I could not fully grasp before (in the last 10 years) what could really have happened.

Just one thing bothers me in this most likely scenario, the short term hiding (occultation) of Madeleine's body as you indicate this should follow the evidences too.

Reasoning like that there could be one other explanation (hiding place) to my mind and that is foremost based on the television documentary from mr. Amaral where the behaviour of Gerry and later both parents was odd to say the least. This was as if (as said by the GNR officers arriving) they were praying as Muslims first on the ground (Gerry) and then on their beds in the parents room next to the closet where the sniffer dog much later alarmed as well as were DNA samples were found.

Could it thus be they never hid the body further than this closet until after the initial search in the night (4am Friday) was over and then hid it when they were the also spotted by George B on the road? To me that would exactly explain that behaviour as they themselves expected the Police to search the apartment but they never did directly. They were almost caught red-handed and thus expected to be so!?! And the GNR (not PJ!) thus made their biggest mistake. Mr Amaral (PJ) only arrived at 9am. Time enough to clean the closet as well and it does directly explain the hours needed for the cadaver scent to settle.

Of course you could argue against as the Smith sighting for instance but that was only reported 2 weeks after the fact and could be a mix-up for sure. Like the Tanner sighting their memories became also better after time which is 'ludicrous'. It does also explain why they stayed in the apartment while everyone else was searching. No caring parents would leave their child out of sight, dead or alive i.e. let alone being able to hide her a night (out of their sight) just after something of such a tragedy happened to her. No doubt in my mind they were caring for her, watching over her, like they still do today.

Let me try to find the reconstruction of how Smith sighting was deformed over time (I believe it was clearly mentioned in the Richard D. Hall Phantoms documentary on Youtube)

The Omega.


Dear Omega,

Thank you for the contribution to the discussion. I hope you had a happy new year.

Your objection is: „Could it thus be they never hid the body further than this closet until after the initial search in the night (4am Friday) was over and then hid it when they were the also spotted by George B on the road?“

Well, I can not see it that way. The Smith statement and its circumstances, such as their concealment first by the British police, then by the investigators appointed by the mccann, the retention of the E-fit, etc., speak clearly. In addition, the Smith have a good reputation that has been repeatedly confirmed independently. The sighting is certainly real.

Regarding the DNA traces and the smell of cadavers: Maddie died at 6 pm, she was taken away by Gerry around 10 pm. Specially trained dogs can already smell it after about 90 minutes of lying time permanently. At a room temperature of about 20 degrees C, bacteria also work extremely effectively. During the revival trials, body material was left on the walls and clothing including Cuddle Cat where they could rot for many more weeks. In the bathroom, the McCann had to wash and left corresponding traces.

In addition, and this is crucial, they could not rely on the fact that the police would not search the apartment, it was just great luck and the risk would have been far greater than to dispose of Maddie to the beach by far. And it was just a 5 minute act for Gerry. Gerry is cool and bold, but not stupid.

The fact that they stayed in the apartment until police came to do searches, besides the fact that there was nothing McCann had to search for, had one main reason: They had to deny the statements and the according list of Tapas group, including the Tanner statement which was important, as to direct the police in the exact opposite direction away from the rocky west beach to the east. At night, Gerry and Kate then started their search, which was nothing but to get Maddie from the rocky west beach to a much safer place far away.

Heribert, 4th Jan. 2019


Hi Heribert,

Thanks for replying. I appreciated facts supporting one theory or the other like you do so well on your website. So let me bring forward some counter 'evidence' that would make mine a rather close call (blue bag in the apartment as seen on PJ photo which could still have Maddie hidden in it…). Like you say Gerry is cool-headed and might have considered that risk of police searching the apartment was small or he was just lucky in the end. So to the evidence to support my theory.

At first the Smith sighting was only reported 2 weeks after the encounter? Why so late? Why did their memories improved over time. Maddie was daily news and they stayed for more days near to it in Praia de Luz and returned home waiting to report eventually. The day of report coincided with Robert Murat made arguido!? The Smith-son thought he had been 'dreaming' asking his dad if he had seen the man carrying the child too.

So two issues around lead to the encounter to happen or being made up for other reasons.

In the Phantoms movie from Richard D. Hall https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dL0-ePd3FCU see as of 1h12m about the Smith sighting brought forward. So: a) it did not happen. To create more confusion and supporting the Tanner-sighting b) it did happen. It could also have been Gerry carrying Ella, the daughter of the Paynes to make a decoy.

On (b) Textusa describes clearly it looked like the encounter was made deliberately by the 'abductor. However the girl carried could only be sedated at that time, not dead…. a lot to read and trying to comprehend how Textusa comes to these conclusions…but makes very good sense too. http://textusa.blogspot.com/2010/03/smith-sighting.html Anyway it is another theory. Whatever theory is true there are multiple people around these days that have lied clearly and will know parts of the truth without having to theorise and just were creating confusion on purpose as a minimum for their own 'best sake.

Hope more evidence comes forward soon

The Omega